Bug? natural? (felon war, but war goals not in redition treaty?)

2016-04-11 00:08:51 Dalmatia (widfara) : indeed, alas could only do betayal,

2016-04-11 00:15:34 Dalmatia (widfara) : passive aggresssion, accept ealy and neutralise the threat, I cant join or declare for 3 yrs

the motivation and goal of the war is for the title.

but ravenna right when war is declared, accepts the reddition treaty 

 

2016-04-11 00:10:35 Dalmatia (widfara) : Article II Peace The Houses Dalmatia and Ravenna solemnly promise to live in peace, harmony and friendship for a duration of at least 3 years. As a gesture of good will and to prove in front of God and men that their peaceful intents are real, each House retrocedes the Seignories that it controls and whose titles are owned by the other House to the other House. Article III Cash donation The House Ravenna promises to pay 0 pounds to the House Dalmatia. As long as the present treaty has not been accepted, this sum will be increased of 1000 pounds each year.

dalmatia says that this is the redition treaty that norbert signed.

i feel this is the same issue as with the bug relating to izzie (rimini) and norbert (ravenna) a few weeks ago, where the titles she owned and were felon were not in the redittion treaty, and she had to give them away.

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So i would like to be enlightened on the subject, is this pretty much the same case?

a betrayal war, as was the war goal was for the duke of tuscany.

is this natural? or a bug?

this is an issue i do not really understand and i feel it is very much like if not the same as the issue discussed here: http://www.marchofhi...s-et-ia/page-11

Yes it's the same bug. Still, that one was probably caused by your karma. 

Someone lives a charmed life , to be sure

Yes it's the same bug. Still, that one was probably caused by your karma. 

Why would you say this?

Yes it's the same bug. Still, that one was probably caused by your karma. 

well at least you told us its a big

i was somewhat hoping itd be a long discussion lol, some times, i just really like to talk

that and my brain just really wanted to know

If its bugged I suppose the rejoicing shall be short lived Norbert, you owe me a title...and no cheating me out of those vassaled to it !

Someone lives a charmed life , to be sure

Well, let's be honest with you, i was hoping you were a smart person, and you would do this only for experimenting, which is what the server is for, so that's why i didn't said a thing. 

But now i see with this thread that the objective was clearly otherwise. what a shame.

Making a fake war to an ally to destroy an opponent you have vassalized by force isn't against the rules (but clearly against their spirit), this is a gray area which allow you to either take a player out against his will by not signing peace when all your mates destroy him or take him the titles/cities away two by two with the felony. Eitheir way he is fucked. And that's something you would never see in reality back then just like it's not in the spirit of this game. 

As far i'm concerned as a player, i would never do this unless the player is an obvious cheater and the admins aren't reacting fast enough or if the player use the mechanics of the games to block on purpose his neighbors from playing and enjoying the game well, just to show him a lesson once that this kind of behavior can also hurt the person who abuse it. 

But as refere, from what i have seen ingame, you can wait forever to get anything from me in this situation. Ask anyone else to do it.

 

Someone lives a charmed life , to be sure

 

Well, let's be honest with you, i was hoping you were a smart person, and you would do this only for experimenting, which is what the server is for, so that's why i didn't said a thing. 

 

But now i see with this thread that the objective was clearly otherwise. what a shame.

 

Making a fake war to an ally to destroy an opponent you have vassalized by force isn't against the rules (but clearly against their spirit), this is a gray area which allow you to either take a player out against his will by not signing peace when all your mates destroy him or take him the titles/cities away two by two with the felony. Eitheir way he is fucked. And that's something you would never see in reality back then just like it's not in the spirit of this game. 

 

As far i'm concerned as a player, i would never do this unless the player is an obvious cheater and the admins aren't reacting fast enough or if the player use the mechanics of the games to block on purpose his neighbors from playing and enjoying the game well, just to show him a lesson once that this kind of behavior can also hurt the person who abuse it. 

 

But as refere, from what i have seen ingame, you can wait forever to get anything from me in this situation.

 

Bye

 

i think in old ages this would be a real tactic, though while not always by the good, and not always by the bad.

he could have joined anyways, i saw him on plenty.

and since this is not against the rules; saying as a referee you would willingly not do anything to fix a bug is unfair and uncalled for.

Saber. Your responses are not always objective. I really do not think that a referee should be playing the same game that they manage. It seems unfair. What if people were afraid to attack you because you are a ref? Oh wait. They are. . . 

This entire game is about war. Why wouldn't people try to create wars to fight them? We didn't expect an instant surrender. We expected gameplay. Gameplay is kind of why we have a game. . .  So,I don't know why you're surprised that people want to play the game. 

and especially since it is not actually a war to destroy; and never has been

Saber. Your responses are not always objective. I really do not think that a referee should be playing the same game that they manage. It seems unfair. What if people were afraid to attack you because you are a ref? Oh wait. They are. . . 

 

This entire game is about war. Why wouldn't people try to create wars to fight them? We didn't expect an instant surrender. We expected gameplay. Gameplay is kind of why we have a game. . .  So,I don't know why you're surprised that people want to play the game. 

as she said, we expected a long war, caused by ravenna not wanting to surrender, and instead could make our own terms.

like last time, though did not go well.

and it is true, you do seem to bring a completley biased, or non nuetral opinion to every case....

Really ? I didn't saw how scared you were all when you guys attacked Adriah, that's really weird. Still he is a much more experimented refere than i am. You guys are great comedians, i give you that.

Anyway, that's not an opinion, that's actually a fact. With that way you can take out any opponent you want once you got the military advantage, i have reported the technique already in the past. 

But i guess it wasn't an important matter back then, since no player used it yet in any server. Maybe this time with a clear example, now it's not only theory anymore, it will be enough to ask some time to the colleagues to fix this.

Really ? I didn't saw how scared you were all when you guys attacked Adriah, that's really weird. Still he is a much more experimented refere than i am. You guys are great comedians, i give you that.

 

Anyway, that's not an opinion, that's actually a fact. With that way you can take out any opponent you want once you got the military advantage, i have reported the technique already in the past. 

 

But i guess it wasn't an important matter back then, since no player used it yet in any server. Maybe this time with a clear example, now it's not only theory anymore, it will be enough to ask some time to the colleagues to fix this.

ive never fought that person .-. 

and i think that was dooran at the time who did that?

finding a way to felon a bad vassal? does not seem unfair, letting him abuse a bug is unfair.

ravenna accepted the redition, and really?

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it is not fair; to target one group, and considering you have stated your dislike of us when you slew accusations at me and i proved you wrong, and even sent you a snap of a part of the issue? and you went and sent to milan telling everyone we were cheaters, even though you were shown we did not use "dupes"

honestly this seems like unfair use of abilities as a referee, especially since you were cussing during our convo that time >.> and did not like when i tried to ask you what you meant (i still never found a username by the name of tol lol)

I also don't remember any war against that username (Adriah). What was the family name? It only sounds vaguely familiar. I've actually not participated in very many wars. 

I also don't remember any war against that username (Adriah). What was the family name? It only sounds vaguely familiar. I've actually not participated in very many wars. 

honestly, i saw the user name once  but i wasnt in italian politics then lol.

didnt you join the game a few years late? (cuz i never saw your name then) i think she was dead by the time you were doing anything lol

-edit: you responded to a very old thread in rawls forums once lol thts probs what you are remembering

I never said you were a cheater to anyone, just like i can't check dupes or anythings of the sort. If you guys want to play the "victims" good for you, the thing is it won't change the facts.

You may pretend you guys are nice and clean people as much as you want, it doesn't change you made a fake war betweens allies from 'best alliance' to either trap the house ravenna in a war he couldn't get out or put felony on him. That's not me, that's you people. 

Anyway, i don't even care about your issues with the house ravenna, if you could kick his ass fair and square, but all the drama things instead only confort me in my idea of how crafty and vicious you people are, which is what made the alarm bell ring here, really disapointing.

I never said you were a cheater to anyone, just like i can't check dupes or anythings of the sort. If you guys want to play the "victims" good for you, the thing is it won't change the facts.

 

You may pretend you guys are nice and clean people as much as you want, it doesn't change you made a fake war betweens allies from 'best alliance' to either trap the house ravenna in a war he couldn't get out or put felony on him. That's not me, that's you people. 

 

Anyway, i don't even care about your issues with the house ravenna, if you could kick his ass fair and square, but all the drama things instead only confort me in my idea of how crafty and vicious you people are, which is what made the alarm bell ring here, really disapointing.

thats actually a lie .-. milan pm'ed me saying you sent him stuff i sent you, and that you told him we were cheaters especially izzie. a friend of yours especially

sure a war, he could have joined, and wed have just decided to let that one go and the others of us declare on him lol

yes fair and square it would be, but he never keeps his word and always runs.

now, we were trying to get a duke title back, even if its not the origional.

seems fair i thinkin.

-it dissapoints me to have a referee, not listen, and when asked specifics on something he is accusing me on, starts cussing at me pretty much and telling other players what i send him.

now thats dissapointing

Norbert stole my titles illegally with his lies and manipulation. In my eyes, he cheated as a scammer would telling you that you won the Nigerian lottery. 

We are using the game to get some titles back. This is actually exactly what you told me to do, Saber. You told me to use the game to solve this dispute. I am. I am not asking for your help to do anything as a personal favor. You are only being addressed here as a referee.

As for your comments and sharing of information. Yes. You did accuse Dal of cheating. It was not right of you to do so. If you do not have proof, or you have nothing to support such things, then you should not say them.  Also, I think most players would prefer you don't tell their game nemeses their personal secrets and things that you learn as a referee. That's called inside trading, and in real life, it is illegal. If someone writes to you as a referee or sends you screenshots, it is absolutely not right for you to share them with regular players. You should only share them in the referee area and to admin.

I do have faith that the titles will be sent to Widfara, because it is fair, and overall you are a fair ref.  Norbert did surrender. This time he actually clicked the button. 

In addition, I am really growing tired of Norbert's negativity and accusations. Posting lies and negative comments into the chat has literally killed it. Italy chat no longer moves. I can not speak there, as I do not wish to instigate any issues. Every time I look at it, Norbert is spewing lies about me. While we have forum mods, we do not have chat mods. So there is nothing that we as players can do but to ignore it. Harassing players is not right though. This harassment is not RP. Accusations that are no where near the arena of roleplay should be strongly discouraged.

Negativity can turn people away from the game. It is the very thing that you, as a referee should be fighting against.

No one's really spoken since the 7th. Pretty much nothing said all weekend.